NP chat (in General)

I've set the default chat room for all veterans back to carnage. You are welcome to change it back to whatever you like, but please do not set it back to NP unless you will primarily be helping genuine new players, as opposed to socializing with other vets, which is best done in the carnage room.

Thanks.

so thats what happened. But thing is no one socializes in carnage...

Maybe you should start a super discussion about something to get things rolling

"But thing is no one socializes in carnage... "

Is this possibly because some of you hangout too much in NP?

NP is a good place to hang out and also the actual new players feel more welcomed, and CB seems more fun, cause then nothing fun would be happening in NP

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I have always felt that NP should, at the very least, emphasize strategy and help.
As a former player who is kinda-sorta thinking about coming back, I would welcome a room where no question is stupid (well, almost).

Back (waaaaay back..lol) when I was somewhat knowledgeable I only ventured into NP if I was outta BA and feeling helpful.

Put another way: If a double-black-diamond skier hits the bunny hill it should be to offer lessons in how to "snow-plow".

Well done, Jon!!
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So there is to be no policy change for NP? Assuming there is an
existing policy listed somewhere...

This reads as though someone who was seen as only socializing
in np would be subject to removal?

What happens in NP chat can have a great effect on what type of community we build. If you stay there and /me a ridicules conversation every time, then you promote obnoxious players who abuse the emote. That is just an example.

People are moldable when in a new environment. "Do as the Romans do" isn't just advise, but what people naturally do. Once people have established a behavior to a new environment, that is usually how they will act from there on when in that environment. Even as time goes on they will often default to the behavior they first learned to emulate.

This is because people naturally have split personalities. I and everyone here have a different personality for almost every person we encounter. There might even be times when you won't know which way to act when two different people are around. It is often the case that people act differently on-line then in real person. Please don't make new players think that acting like a newb all the time is acceptable here at CB.

In summation, don't move to NP chat unless you are willing to be a true role model.

Well I personally think this will end badly. Not all the mentors that are currently mentors are good ones. That's my opinion, but I bet others agree. So soon there will be a small amount of people in new players when a new player shows up. Therefor making it seem like this community isn't here. At least right now there is an active chat in new players. So when a new person shows up they get greeted and welcomed.

Again this is my opinion, but I feel this is a bad move.

Essentially, all non-mentor/mentee traffic is unwelcome in NP, at least that seems to be the line being established. I have no desire to mentor a specific group of people, I'm normally at work and unable to help, but when I want to help it was really nice to be able to. Thanks to those who were so spaztic they couldn't keep there mouth shut...

I don't think the problem is quantity Cylo. For all I care there could be a hundred people in NP. My concern would be in quality.

Now, are you saying that some people should be removed from the mentor list? Should there be a mentor test?

yes. I personally believe there should be some qualifications to being a mentor. Not a time limit, but something.

Just in case it isn't clear, I'm only speaking from my opinions. Not from a position of enforcement. As far as I know, there isn't a NP chat policy.

Yes there is vestax. lol. that's what this is about. People are being asked to leave new players if they aren't a mentor or new. So yes Jon made a new policy. I was just stating my opinion on it.

I'm glad people talk so much in NP, if i were new and i joined a game were no chattting was going on in the "chat" i would think the game was stupid and played by little. But with chat going, it lets people know that people do play and like the game, it shouldnt scare them away from asking questions, but yes, people in new players should be fine with chatting, JUST so they watch out for new players questions. I know its not set to permanent carnage chatting still, but just thought id throw it out there.

It's really pretty simple, honestly. You will now be entering directly into Carnage and all your friends will be there. The 14 lines of hellos and huggling can still take place. If you feel the need to sing, emote about curling up on the floor, suck your thumb, announce how hungry you are and what you intend to do about it, throw balls or weddings ( :P ) or hand-held toys, feel free to do so.

If you get that happy little message that says your newest mentee has arrived, pop in and say "Hi!", introduce yourself and offer to answer any questions. If your mentee is ignoring you, tells you where to go, insists on buying a DCM and going it alone, or doesn't understand the question, shrug & go back to playing Chat Scrabble in Carnage.

If you see one of your previously acquired mentees in, pop in and say "Hi!", offer any additional assistance. You can _even_ offer to take them to Carnage and introduce them to all the wonderful people you know! :)

None of this prevents you from PMing your mentees, acolytes, factota (factotums?) & nooblets all the expertise your fingers can type, of course. (one of the key benefits of PM is that you needn't even be _in_ the same room)

You can certainly /who New Players. If there appears to be plenty of OPs, and people you know to be helpful in residence, your assistance is not immediately required. If this is not a judgement you feel capable of making on your own, consider whether the ratio of New Players to Vets to OPs is hovering around 5:15:5. If it is, what more could you possibly have to add?

By all means, /join New Players once a day -- introduce yourself and offer assistance. If no one takes you up on your offer, go back to Carnage. Then you'll get _another_ 14 lines of hellos upon your return -- bonus for you!

I asked, and not any of the people who are so outraged about being asked to graduate to Carnage could say they felt the New Players couldn't possibly get along without their extraordinary expertise. So what is the problem?

I fail to see how you can really _need_ Jon to make an absolute "rule" excluding you from New Players before you think it's "fair" that you be asked to continue the shenanigans, antics and stoogery outside of New Players.

More than one of the offended seems to feel that only the "troublemakers!" should be moved. No actual violation of the basic rules of chat (which can be found in the Help) has taken place -- those people _are_ /kicked or /killed out of chat. The society of New Players habitues has simply outgrown New Players -- so the whole microcosm has been asked to move itself to a venue befitting its size and level of boisterousness.

For those whose response is "Fine, then I'm just not going to be helpful anymore! Nah nah nah!", what are you expecting to hear other than "Okay."? Unless you also plan on flooding New Players with an extra 100-200 _real_ New Players a day, I'm not seeing how that will be a problem either.

"You will now be entering directly into Carnage and all your friends will be there."

No?!!?

meh.

Bast, bravo.

My repeated request for clarification were based on people who claimed to have been kicked in the middle of helping someone.

I'm assuming that ops will now be constantly monitoring to ensure there
is always someone sitting in NP bored out of there skull waiting for the possibility of a question to be asked...

How is that ANY better than the "chaos" that has been reported often enough that we've been "moved". Who is going to sit in a dead chat room and wait for new person to ask a question? How LAME is chat going to be for new players now? There isn't a clear statment of who is and isn't supposed to be in new players. If we've returned to a point where those who are obviously helping are welcome and idlers and chatters are not, fine, but please be clear about it. At this point it seems that vets are simply not wanted to NP, and no matter how much you think NP is covered Bast I think you'll find that more and more there won't be someone awake to answer the question.

truck: no question is stupid in NP when I'm online.

"Awake" should be taken care of by having the idlers idle in Carnage.

My comparison is the difference between trying to do a "dayshift" in there (holy hemorrhoids, Batman!) and the 4-10 hrs a night (server time) I spend in there 4 nights a week.

One or two OPs, a vet or two, and New Players rolling in and out all night long. Everyone who comes in gets welcomed. Chat inevitably (& spontaneously) breaks out. Announcements of having reached the milestone 10k PR get applauded. "Sup(?)", which I take to be a beer-commercial version of "How is everyone and everything?", gets responded to. New Players tell us where they are from or what they are listening to, or what they have just watched.

Someone will ask about putting Giant Strength on a mage. The answer will involve an explanation of Tank, Mage, Enchanter, Wall, and how to use the Help function. Without asinine chat intervening, better explanations than "don't, it'll kill your rewards" are proffered for the 15-times-a-day asked question about equipping _stuff_. Questions about things found on the boards are answered. FS/WTB is explained as involving not a single foul, four-letter word.

Questions get asked and answered in open chat, such that bad info, bad advice, wrong answers and general meanness &/or patronizing can be _seen_ and countered by others in the room. Acronyms are avoided, or immediately explained, because chat scrolls slowly enough ( and is focused enough) to allow for that.

So ... what was the question?

Sorry Bast. I usually agree with most things you say or type, but this one is a bit off. Typing a long winded response to something and putting in the biggest most non-used words possible doesn't actually answer anything that was said.

I personally think that me being in new players and visiting with people, new or old, didn't actually change the face of the game. Now, with there being a smaller, much smaller, amount of people in new players, 17 when I signed on, and a huge number in carnage, 31 when I signed on. New players aren't going to see the chat that they normally see when entering the game.

I personally think that if I were to join a game and there are but a few people that might say hello to me, and if there are actually any live people chatting at the time I join the game I might not see any chat happening, that to me would make me think this game doesn't have that much of a community and might make me leave the game. How long did it take you to learn that you could type /join <insert room name here> and go to a different room. I for one know it took me some time to find that out and until I did I was in new players and thought that was all there was.

Yes chat in Carnage will go crazy as it is right now. 31 people and all having a great time, but for all the new players that join they won't see that rolling chat screen that makes this game look alive and fun. Prove to me that that energetic atmosphere continues in new players when you kick all the vets out and I will say I'm wrong, but I doubt that will be the case in a few days time when none of the new player regulars come in anymore.

Again this is just my opinion and might not be worth the time I spent typing it, but it's still my opinion. Only time will tell if I'm right or wrong, but I think I'm right.

And I was wondering why the carnage room hadn't seem as lively as I'd remembered as of late...

I hate this idea....why push us out.

Instead why not make a new permanent room for vets who don't like carnage.


Note: I know we can create our own, but noone is ever in temp rooms.

and another permanent room other than Carnage and New Players would make a difference from a temp room....how?

I think it is a bad move personally, I have seen a great deal of friendships forged between newplayers and vets, probably friendships as strong as between many vets. I think the newplayers look forward to signing in and seeing a familiar face, getting GENIUNLY greated by a top ranked player, and having a conversation.

The new players that are joining CB should not be segregated (which is really what is happening). I have only been playing for a few months, and it wasn't until I was promoted to room carnage that I even knew it existed. If I joined today, and had ONLY a handful of new players to talk to, most of whom you never see again after the first day, and a robot "monitoring" the room for new questions... guess what, I most likely wouldn't be signing back in after my first run of BA was gone.

Anyway, I think this needs to be rethought if we want to keep our new players interested. I am a mentor, and one out of 10 new players logs back in after their initial visit as it is. There is no way this move can do anything but discourage new users.

If there is a problem with behaviour in NP, and influence of the new players, I say create a strict code that MUST be adhered to while in NP chat, but don't restrict veterans from interacting with new players.

anyway just my opinion

The only thing we need in NP is less strict admins..

someone needs to define new player so everyone is on the same sheet of music here. my 2 cents

Hurricane, you are the type of person the admins/op need to be strict on. If you would just accept the change, they wouldn't have to be so strict. I think they are all doing a great job. I am only glad that I will never see you in charge of something that important. It would be a huge disaster .

Who actually said chat would be banned full stop from New Players?
Who said that Only New Players, Ops, admins and mentors were allowed in New Players?

I'm pretty sure Jon didn't specify that, because I'm damn sure I read it as "only go in there if you're feeling helpful" which is to encourage you offering the help rather than spamming chat before seeing a question.

On a side note, why is it that around two thirds of the "angry villagers" have a lack of comprehension?

Zog: as I understand it, people are welcome to help other people in new players, and that's about it. The ratio of vets to np is being tightly controlled, and off topic chat is discouraged. This means that new players wanting to talk come to carnage, and ask questions here...

Just to put this out there. Does anyone believe any amount of whining will really make Jon switch it back? Because i doubt it.

Just another obeservation from me (a nobody) Everytime I have logged in since the new change has taken place BOTH chatrooms are now dead and look like the carnage room of old. If that was the desired effect great job, and great job to the Admin. for doing such a great job of keeping chat to a minimum everywhere.

Just a statement. Is it really ever active on a Saturday 11 am server time? I thought not...

as anyone who knows me is probably aware of... "everytime I log in" dosen't refer to once in a 24 hour period. For those that don't know me I average 1500+ fights per day so do the math.

Since this change has taken place. There is an average of 13 people in new players when I sign on which is quite often. I don't see how this is going to work out, but only time will tell.

If you look at my earlier posts. You see that I think this is bad and will be detrimental to the game. I am keeping track of new players for teh week, and how many people play per week which is in community section, so after 2 or 3 weeks we can see if this change was for the good or bad.

So far it looks bad.